Replace V3 Capslock with Ctrl will not work.



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    **Edit - Ok after more testing, it does work, but also doesn't really... due to it pressing and releasing the key, so it makes combos where you need the mod held (such as Ctrl + a) won't work because the key is released. I will see if I can work around this, but most likely cannot be resolved due to the up/down-state issue within the logic. 


    Hello Mischa, 

    Your findings are correct, it doesn't appear as if control when programmed will be recognized by the OS until another key is pressed as well. I will ask our devs about this, I'm not sure if it's a bug or just how it needs to be, I was told it was an issue with the up/down state of the mods and not something that could not be fixed/avoided with the way it's currently programmed. We are completely redesigning the firmware from the ground up, and it's possible that the new firmware will not have this issue/limitation. 

    I kept thinking about how when paired with another key, it will register (but also register that other key...) so I made many attempts and I think I have found a workaround / solution to this problem and to have just that single key recognized by the OS as it should be. I thought, what if the key that you're pairing is the same key? So instead of programming Caps Lock to be Alt, I programmed it to be L_Alt AND R_Alt? - It turns out it works.

    This also works for the OS keys as there is a duplicate of both Alt and OS on both sides of the spacebar, as well as Ctrl keys, however there is a caveat with Ctrl as you can't use R_Ctrl for programming (Unless you relocate the Pgm key, which is also easy...) but I then did more experimentation and realized that it doesn't really matter which key comes before the actual key you want, so I was able to program Caps to L_Ctrl by setting Caps as my trigger and then holding the right OS key, then hitting L_Ctrl to set that as the target. 

    I can confirm it registers with the OS using keyboard test software. Which if you don't use the "double key" method I outlined above, it seemingly will not register when just trying to swap by single target. 

    Try it out! 

    1. Enter programming mode (Fn + Pgm)
    2. Hit the key you want as trigger (in this case Caps Lock)
    3. Hit and hold the trigger key L_Ctrl (in this case) then hit the "extra" key which we can use R_Win (or os key)
    4. Hit the Pgm key to affirm programming
    5. Exit programming mode (Fn + Pgm) 

    I did attempt some more experimentation, and it does appear that you need to use some modifier as your "extra" key to throw in there, as a regular alpha key will then try and press that key as well, but for some reason it does not press the modifier. Strange. 

    The only real difference I can see now is that when hitting the real key, it will repeat keystroke, while the newly programmed key will not repeat keystroke, I don't think this will be an issue for most situations, however it is something to consider. 

    Thank you. 



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    Also, I forgot to mention that another workaround is to simply flash the V2.5 firmware if all you want is Caps to Ctrl via the dipswitch, which we have made available; 

    Thank you. 

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    Mischa Schaub

    Hi David
    Thanks for the info and for your research!
    Then I will have to use the old firmware 2.5.
    The Capslock Key as CTRL Key, is one of the best features I've ever seen on a keyboard. It is good to be able to do without, even if I would like to have never used new features of the latest firmware, such as the layer system.
    Will the function be integrated again in the future, as with version 2.5?


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    Hello Mischa, 

    No problem, I tried my best to find you a workaround, or to get this to work for you but sadly I don't believe it's possible, I will try a bit more today to see if I can come up with something. I'm hoping with the new redesign of the firmware it will solve this issue. 

    Another workaround is to simply make this swap using software, this is very easy to do in software. :) 

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    Mischa Schaub

    So I have now reset the firmware to 2.5. Now the CTRL key works on Capslock again as it should.
    Software solutions to re-key the keys are problematic in some situations.
    So of course I have to do without the new features, which I do not like to do.
    It is not quite clear to me, why you did not keep this original functionality of the CTRL-Capslock-Switch in the new firmware. Because obviously it works on the level of electronics.
    And the fact that the CTRL key is needed even without using a second key in many programs, is actually nothing that would be surprising now.

    It's a bit hard for me to understand why you (your technicians) did not notice this during the firmware design process.

    Especially since the Capslock-CTRL exchange was one of the core features of the original keyboards and you have successfully advertised. At the time, that helped me and the V3 is unfortunately a clear step backwards for me in this respect.
    That the Indicator-LED colors in the new V3 are changeable, was for me one of the reasons for buying. Now I have to do without it...
    Can you tell me when there will be more information on whether I can still use the new features in the future - with the old Capslock control behavior.

    Cheers, Mischa

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    Pascal Bouchareine

    Hi there,

    A true Capslock/CTRL swap is a very appreciated feature here too.

    Would love a dipswitch ctrl swap + the v3 features in a future firmware

    Also kudos for keeping the firmware downgrade an option and documenting it as well, it really helps in the meantime

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    Yes the 2.5 firmware has this swap on the dipswitch :) A lot of other users prefer caps as esc though, so it's hard to allow some features for some people's preferences and not for others, which is why we wanted to go with the full programmability in the first place.  

    I suppose it depends on the software you're using, and what OS you're running. We had to omit a lot of the switch level changes to free up some room for other functions of the dipswitch which were needed for the programmable features. 

    I'm not aware of a lot of programs that utilize just a Ctrl press without paired with another key, but no doubt they are out there as you have experienced it. 

    I can empathize with you not being able to understand why this was overlooked during creation, and I don't have a ton of the details myself, but a lot of it was a fairly large miscommunication, some other important parts being lost in translation, and a few other factors as to why the firmware is in the state it is in right now. This is also the reason why the firmware is being rebuilt from the ground up instead of just a revision or something simpler. 

    I don't have an ETA on when the new firmware will be finished or even the details of what it can do, but as soon as I get more info I will definitely pass it along. 

    I'm very sorry for not being able to provide a better solution to you at this time Mischa, and if I come across one I will definitely let you know. 

    Thank you! 


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    Mischa Schaub

    Hi David
    Thanks again for the answer. It seems important to me that you pass on this information to the developers. Maybe then chances are good that this problem will be solved in the future. Anyway, I hope so and keep my fingers crossed that this succeeds.

    Yes, one might think that the CTRL key is rarely included as an independent event in programs.
    But there are two very common situations where this does not apply.

    1) In games, the CTRL is almost always included as a regular event. Especially because in games, the control of the players is often customized. For example, if you shoot or duck on the CTRL key, this must be your own event.
    Especially with the WASD control (and you even carry it in your name), it is really a big advantage to be able to use the CapsLock key as a CTRL key, since the little finger comes to rest exactly on the CapsLock key.

    2) Other programs do not include the CTRL key directly as their own event, but very often it is used in combination with mouse clicks. So it makes a difference if you just click or hold down the CTRL or ALT key. And many programs make use of it, such as Photoshop, to name just a prominent example.
    And of course this does not work anymore if the keyboard does not trigger a stand-alone event for the CTRL key.

    Greetings, Mischa

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    Excellent examples, thanks for listing them. I agree Ctrl and other modifier keys should be sending their own individual event when pressed after being remapped. Hopefully the firmware can be updated soon to include that. I do not know how much else our developers are working on right now, but we'll be letting them know of this issue. Stay tuned and we'll be releasing a notification when there is a firmware update.

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    Mischa Schaub

    That's good to hear. Thanks a lot!

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